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The Voice of the Kurds: Interview with
Osman Baydemir, the mayor of Diyarbakir
21.12.2007
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December 21, 2007
Diyarbakir, Kurdish Southeastern region of
Turkey,-- The office of the mayor of Diyarbakir,
Osman Baydemir, is always crowded with visitors
just as he wants it to be. A lawyer who abandoned
his profession for the sake of politics, Baydemir is
passionate about working with people. Around his
office you would meet both visitors and his team of
aides and researchers, some of whom hold doctorate
degrees specializing in Kurdish issues.
The office is strewn with books and documents with
graphs on the social and economic situation of the
Kurds today, in addition to research documents that
propose ways with which to resolve the tensions
between Ankara and the armed Kurds.
Some in Turkey draw parallels between Baydemir and
Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan when he
was mayor of Istanbul (1994); both were quite young
when they occupied the post and both have a
considerable following among the people and they
also prioritized the economic and social situation. |
Osman Baydemir, one of Turkey's most popular Kurdish
politicians and the mayor of Diyarbakir, the main
city in the Kurdish-majority southeast of Turkey. |
But what is more
important is the fact that both of them have a
deep-seated ‘creed’ and are not simply technocrat
politicians.
Following is the text of the interview with the
Mayor of Diyarbakir, Osman Baydemir:
Q: How would you
define the Kurdish problem today?
A: The Kurdish
problem is a thousand years old. It is an
international problem that is not only specific to
the region. It is also a political, economic,
cultural and human problem that is related to human
rights. Therefore, we cannot say that it is a
one-dimensional or one-sided problem, rather, it is
multi-dimensional.
From 1920 to date, it has been one of the major
issues in Turkey if not the largest. Theoretically
speaking, Turkey may be considered an ideal state in
the Middle East and other states can follow its
example. However, the reality of the ongoing Kurdish
issue over the past 80 years hinders Turkey from
being defined as an ideal state that can be emulated
on a democratic level.
Not only has the Kurdish problem had an impact on
Turkey’s state of democracy, it has also affected
the economic situation. I believe that if the
Kurdish problem is resolved through dialogue then
the Turkish state will have resolved one of its
biggest issues. If this problem is not resolved
through peaceful means and dialogue then Turkey
cannot be considered a democratic state, and thus
consequently we cannot refer to it as the ideal
democratic state in the region.
Q: When Turkey
began official negotiations to join the European
Union (EU) and granted the Kurdish people cultural
rights within the framework of the cultural reforms
that were demanded by the EU, there was a prevalent
belief that the demands of the Kurds in Turkey had
been fulfilled is that true? And what are the
obstacles obstructing the resolution of the Kurdish
problem today?
A: In 1999, towards the
resolution of the Kurdish issue, two important
events took place: Firstly, the Kurdish forces
changed their strategy in Turkey when those who had
taken up arms (the Kurdistan Workers Party - PKK)
against the Turkish military left Turkey and began
to explicitly call for the resolution of the Kurdish
issue using dialogue and peaceful means.
This development revived the hopes of the Turks and
Kurds alike that the problem would be solved
peacefully and through employing dialogue methods.
It was this development that prompted the EU to
commence official accession negotiations with Turkey
in 1999. However, prior to that and since the end of
1982, the Turkish state had taken very limited steps
to grant the Kurdish people the cultural rights that
they have been demanding. But they were incredibly
limited [steps].www.ekurd.net
For example, the state
of emergency that had been imposed on Diyarbakir
region over the past 25 years was lifted, and
capital punishment was abolished from the Turkish
penal laws. The price of that punishment was paid
mainly by the Kurds whom the state had charged with
treason or accused of endangering national security.
The beginning of talks with the EU in 1999 led to
the improvement of conditions for the Kurds in
Turkey. Prior to that, Kurdish people were forbidden
to name their children Kurdish names, but now this
has changed. Also, the Kurdish language which is not
officially recognized was dealt with differently on
an official level; today Turkish television
broadcasts 45 minutes in the Kurdish language.
Although we consider these to be major developments,
we also consider 45 minutes to be too short. Over
the span of 80 years, the Turkish state used to tell
us that there was no such thing as ‘Kurd’ or
‘Kurdish’. You are the mountain Turks, meaning that
you live in the mountains. The state used to
consider us backward Turks. At last they have
recognized us as Kurds (laughs), which is a
considerable improvement for us.
However; the problem is that despite some
modifications, the authority’s manner in dealing
with and resolving the Kurdish issue has not
radically changed. In fact, starting from October
2005, the Turkish state began to retract these small
steps that it had taken towards reform and the
military confrontation flared up once again and the
killing resumed.
Furthermore, the cultural rights of the Kurdish
people have diminished. The situation in 2002 and
2003 was far better than the current situation. For
example, Abdullah Demirbas, the former mayor of the
Sur district in Diyarbakir who was dismissed from
office, as were all the members of the municipal
council [which was dissolved], who all suffered the
same fate because they had offered some municipal
services in other languages, Kurdish and English
along with the Turkish language.
Another example is the fact that there are 30
lawsuits filed against me, all of which are related
to use of the Kurdish language. On the Kurdish New
Year, or Nowruz [celebrated 21 March] we used to
send out greeting cards. I wrote in the greeting
cards “Happy New Year” in Turkish, Kurdish and
English and I sent them to the president, prime
minister, the MPs and the heads of courts in
Diyarbakir. Many of these officials sent back the
greeting cards and refused to accept them. They said
it was because the greeting card included a line in
the Kurdish language. The head of the Diyarbakir
Court did not reply to the card but he did not send
it back either.
I was ecstatic and thought he had accepted my well
wishes; however, 10 or 15 days later, he sent me a
writ of summons to begin an investigation because I
had used the Kurdish letter ‘w’ that does not exist
in the Turkish language and which is a punishable
crime in Turkey. So then I answered the court chief
back with a question; I said, ‘Your Honor, in order
to access the Turkish Ministry of Justice website
you have to type in the letters ‘www’, so why is the
English ‘w’ accepted but the Kurdish one deemed a
crime?www.ekurd.net
The truth is that the
human mind cannot accept such practices. In the 21st
century, there exists a language that is spoken by
20 million people, which is the Kurdish language,
and it is prohibited. There are dozens of similar
examples pertaining to the letter ‘w’.
Q: Do you think
Kurdish representation in the new Turkish parliament
(22 MPs) can help the municipality of Diyarbakir and
the Kurds to communicate their voice to the
authorities in Ankara?
A: The Kurdish
members in the Turkish parliament act as a base for
the Kurdish issue. Their main task is to put an end
to the ongoing war against the Kurds. We are
confident that this problem cannot be resolved
through military means, but with dialogue instead.
My fear is that the authorities in Ankara may not
offer them the opportunity to broach the problems
and demands of the Kurds to parliament.
However, the Kurdish parliamentarians can help
achieve the economic demands of the people of
Diyarbakir since previously there was no doorway for
us from which to demand economic projects in the
city. Electing Kurdish MPs will reduce the burden on
the Kurdish municipalities, and on a political level
they would act as a mouthpiece for the Kurds. From
now on, we will focus on the municipal demands of
the Kurds in Diyarbakir. As for the political
demands, the Kurdish MPs will propose them.
Q: You talked
about resolving the Kurdish problem using peaceful
means, what is your view of the PKK and its armed
elements, some of whom are fighting in the mountains
again?
A: This is a
very sensitive subject. In my personal opinion, the
PKK is not the reason behind the Kurdish problem;
rather it is an outcome of the Kurdish problem. If
the Turkish perception [of the Kurds] since 1924,
when the Turkish republic was first established, to
date was not the way it is then there would be no
reason for the presence of the PKK. Weapons are
never the language of dialogue when it pertains to a
problem. If Turkey’s perception of the Kurds
remained unchanged then another party would emerge
bearing a different name if the PKK were to
disappear.
Q: You are an
official in the Turkish state and you are also a
Kurdish politician who expresses the demands of the
Kurds in Turkey, how do you strike a balance between
the two?
A: This is the
right path that we should follow. I sometimes say
that we have to walk on the sharp edge of the sword.
Naturally, balancing is difficult, but it is for
this difficulty and for the sense of pride I feel in
practicing my work. I am originally a lawyer; I
practiced the profession for 18 years before I was
elected as mayor of Diyarbakir.
The suits that were filed against me, since I
assumed the position, are more than the cases for
which I pleaded. If I get convicted in all the cases
against me, I would have to spend 280 years in jail.
But if there is justice, none of these charges would
warrant convictions.
What I would like to say is that if one does not
have the will to achieve something then no one would
have been the mayor of Diyarbakir. Despite what I
was subjected to, I remained hopeful because the
demands of the Kurdish people are legitimate. When I
was elected as a mayor of Diyarbakir three and a
half years ago, I told the Kurds in Diyarbakir: If
Ankara closes the door on us; we will enter from the
window. We would never flee the confrontation with
Ankara. The problem, however, is that besides
placing restrictions on the cultural rights that
were given to us years ago, the authorities in
Ankara also act to constrain us economically in
Diyarbakir. When the people of Diyarbakir witness no
improvement in the public services, they have no
other option but to punish the municipal council or
the municipality of Diyarbakir.
Q: There is talk
on the streets of Diyarbakir that the central
authorities in Ankara have reduced the budget
allocated to the city in order to put pressure on
the Kurdish people, is this true? And if so, is that
legitimate?
A: Reducing
financial support for Diyarbakir from the national
budget is neither legal nor moral. There are over 10
development projects in Diyarbakir that European
countries have agreed to finance but Ankara has
refused, which is heartbreaking. If we look at the
economic situation of the inhabitants of Diyarbakir
we would find that people here suffer from poverty.
I feel responsible for this deteriorating situation.
Throughout the past 20 years we used to tell the
inhabitants of Diyarbakir that they deserve a better
life that has yet to happen. The Kurdish people
have given all that they had; villages, land and
farms during the military confrontations with the
Turkish army because of the evacuation operations in
the villages and the displacement of the population.
The price was expensive, but the demands in return
were not cheap; they were demands for national
identity.
Q: Your office
is always busy with people, is that evidence of many
problems?
A: Since I was
elected as mayor of the city, I opened up the
municipality to the Kurdish people so that they may
participate and share their views. Anyone who wants
to meet me can do that. But Diyarbakir is a big city
and it’s impossible to meet everyone. My day begins
at 7am and ends at 10pm, sometimes I stay in my
office until 1am, and that includes my holidays.
In Diyarbakir, we designate two or three days to
meet with the residents but, of course, the
municipality headquarters cannot receive everyone.
This is why we hold an open meeting for the public,
usually held in one of Diyarbakir’s public squares.
It is attended by all the local officials and all
the local languages (Kurdish and Armenian among
others) can be used during these public meetings.
Q: Is it true
that the Islamic-inclined ruling Justice and
Development Party [AKP] is reinforcing the Islamists
in Diyarbakir in an attempt to weaken the Kurdish
nationalist movement? Are there Kurdish-Kurdish
differences that are related to dealing with the
state?
A: The Kurdish
people are religious but religion has been exploited
during the past 80 years. At present, they have been
exploiting the poor economic situation against the
Kurds as they had once used religion.
With regards to Kurdish-Kurdish problems, I can say
that they do not exist. There are various parties in
Diyarbakir but there are no grave disputes between
them. Perhaps there are some fighters who get paid
to wreak havoc on the Kurdish issue, but this is a
malaise that afflicts all societies. There will
always be people who can be bought in return for
money.
Q: The Kurds of
Iraq want full autonomy or federal rule, what are
the demands of the Kurds of Turkey?
A: Nothing is
clear on this subject. The situation for the Kurds
in Turkey is different from those in Syria, Iraq and
Iran. There are two out of five Turkish Kurds who
leave Diyarbakir to go to other cities, meaning that
two out of five are living amongst Turks, and that
is a marked change from the Kurds in Syria, Iraq and
Iran. Consequently, I do not believe in the
likelihood of the independence of the Turkish Kurds
from the Turkish state as we are a mixed people.
However, the question is: Why is the Turkish state
concerned with the Turks who live in Bulgaria or the
Turkmen of Iraq, for example, and yet shows no
interest in its Kurdish citizens? It would be best
for Turkey to show more concern towards its Kurds,
recognize the Kurdish identity, allow for the
official use of the Kurdish language and reinstate
the Kurdish names of the villages, because these are
some of the realities in the region.
The state’s perception of the Kurds has to change.
When that happens, Ankara should then ask the Kurds:
What do you want? The solution would lie in that.
The Turkish state would be surprised to find that
the demands of the Kurds are not that much. Their
demands are nothing in comparison to the wars, blood
and killing that takes place between the two
parties. Both the Kurds and the Turks want peace and
an end to the fighting. No one should have to die at
the hands of the two parties.
aawsat com
** Kurds are not recognized as an official minority
in Turkey and are denied rights granted to other
minority groups. Under EU pressure, Turkey recently
granted Kurds limited rights for broadcasts and
education in the Kurdish language, but critics say
the measures do not go far enough.
The use of the term "Kurdistan" is vigorously
rejected due to its alleged political implications
by the Republic of Turkey, which does not recognize
the existence of a "Turkish Kurdistan" Southeast
Turkey.
Others estimate over 40 million Kurds live in Big
Kurdistan (Iraq, Turkey, Syria, Iran, Armenia),
which covers an area as big as France, about half of
all Kurds which estimate to 20 million live in
Turkey.
Turkey is home to over 25 million ethnic Kurds, a
large Turkey's Kurdish community openly sympathise
with the Kurdish PKK for a Kurdish homeland in the
country's mainly Kurdish southeast of Turkey.
Before August 2002, the Turkish government placed
severe restrictions on the use of Kurdish language,
prohibiting the language in education and broadcast
media. The Kurdish alphabet is still not recognized
in Turkey, and use of the Kurdish letters X, W, Q
which do not exist in the Turkish alphabet has led
to judicial persecution in 2000 and 2003
The Kurdish flag flown officially in Iraqi Kurdistan
but unofficially flown by Kurds in Armenia. The flag
is banned in Iran, Syria, and Turkey where flying it
is a criminal offence"
Southeastern Turkey:
North Kurdistan (
Kurdistan-Turkey)
wikipedia
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